A 147 grain non plus P might start dropping or least stop acceleration at less than 16 inches. This is why K.E. I also have rhe Rock Island 9mm/22 TCM & an AR 45 pistol. https://www.personaldefenseworld.com/2017/03/9mm-40-45-acp-stopping-power/ PS. If a 9mm fails, it won't perform anywhere close to an unexpanded .45 and will punch a tony hole. I totally agree with the author. Adam and Eve passed on the nature of sin (spiritual death) to the whole human race (see Romans 5:12-21), which is why we MUST be "born again of the spirit in order to enter the Kingdom of God" (see John 3:3). They will both have the same result! It offers a larger magazine capacity given a similarly sized firearm. You must slow down. I would have to say that for me I am more accurate with a .45 acp then a 9mm but that may be because the 1911 is a better fit for me and feels better balanced then a polymer 9mm. Damn good question and I have wondered this myself. I bought it for my wife close to 40 years ago, then she decided not to shoot anymore, sad and not so safe. The last comment is assuming that a high velocty rifle round is a good penetrator. Most likely they use it because they want to be special and have a pretty gun to stand out from the peons using standard issue pistols. Don't be so quick to kill your brother just because his opinion is different than yours . Google DoubleClick IDE cookies are used to store information about how the user uses the website to present them with relevant ads and according to the user profile. Prvi PPU 9mm Ammunition White Box PP9124WB 124 Grain Full Metal Jacket CASE 1000 Rounds. Speer 124 Grain 9mm +P Ammo Average Velocity: 1194 fps Average Muzzle Energy: 392 ft/lbs But, firing rounds takes time. You'll now receive newsletters of our best articles on techniques, Well written, and no trash talking, rare in the gun world. . Physics works whether you're a criminal or a descent citizen. This is the true reasons behind the FBI changing back to the 9mm. But I know you won't understand. ANYONE who says in a civilian encounter they can end it in 3 shots is either a psychopath, a liar, or never been in a SHTF scenario. But if the FBI and cops have reverted to 9mm, I'm comfortable with it too. I have been shot, it happened in the suburbs back in '74. The Glock is my every day carry. Everyone has their own confidence level and may believe what people tell them or what they read. I think there was a fundamental mistake about over penetration in this article. In conclusion: These people that sit at the alter of the FBI make me laugh. 333 ft/lbs. And that's why an old lady clings to her old 1911 :). When comparing the two handguns, its important to note that the 9mm hasnt become better than the .45 ACPit just caught up to it. Even if your bullet is only traveling an inch, it will lose velocity, as air drag is steadily wearing down momentum. The reason why these calibers don't do any better is that they are more likely to over penetrate (thus doing less energy as much of the bullet's energy is released outside the body). 9mm, 40, or 45acp Can't make my mind up and like them all. Thank you! Their unique testing is quite helpful in choosing ammo and seeing what happens in similar barrels. Their non-noob advisors must suss out and add realistic priority to the criteria a noob might have learned from grampa, hollywood or G knows where. However, if trained professionals only have 20-30% accuracy, it's not unreasonable to think that many of us would only have 15-20% accuracy in a self defense scenario. My nightstand pistol is a Glock 41, but I would only grab it if one of my AK47s stopped firing. That is why some like the 9mm short or .380. Forced to choose I'd take 9mm all day for so many reasons.. 9mm or 45? 2. As for a Defence caliper the 22 or is the most deadliest cartridge for a handgun at 375 yards I can put right between your eyes or I can put it between your ribs and put a hole in your heart. If you are choosing the 9mm simply because of capacity, you might want to also consider the FN Herstal FNX-45. The 9mm is no pea shooter and a.45 acp is not a one shot giant killer. It is simulated human tissue that will show hydrostatic shock, penetration, and expansion . Because thats how many studies there are. We are now restricted to 10 or less rounds in the mag here in Washington State. No looks or ballistics tests are going to help you there. (I carry .40 Smith & Wesson or a .45 Auto pistol with concealed carry.) I have my shooting partner tell me which to shoot. Thank you. Conversely, the 9mm spits out a 115- and 147-grain bullet anywhere around 1,000 to 1,300 fps at the muzzle, with energy ranging from 294 to 495 at the muzzle. Where I grew up an old timer who was still an incredibly good shot was asked which he would rather be holding in a gunfight. Threat is neutralized. Youll see a muzzle velocity listed for nearly all ammo, sometimes even right on the box. It'll take all kinds of enthusiasm away from your intruder whether you use choked turkey shot or 00. Analytical cookies are used to understand how visitors interact with the website. We use cookies on our website to give you the most relevant experience by remembering your preferences and repeat visits. Then rinse and repeat as needed. It appears that overall, the optimal barrel length for 9mm (for something like an AR-15 pistol build, SBR, or similar setup), is about 7 to 8 inches for maximum efficiency and handling, though going longer can still have benefits. I like both & depending on where I'm going, how long I'll be gone, what I'm wearing & how I'm feeling makes my choice for me. Velocity did of course increase further with longer barrels, but to a much smaller degree. First to mention, we are limited to FMJ rounds, no HP no JHP, just plain FMJ. They are not 'cheap' as in inexpensive, either. Springfield 1911 A1 .45ACP +P ported and polished. Same debates have raged on Betamax vs VHS, mustang vs camaro, HD-DVD vs Bluray, etc etc. 45 loses in every category except possibly suppression and shallow penetration, if you want to call that a pro. Both rounds are more than enough to put a guy down. But to a victim or an attacker, what happens when an intruder gets hit by birdshot may be a lot different to 00. (Technically, the bullet is fastest at the instant the explosion occurs and the bullet is expelled from the cartridge.). In that case consider a 10mm or .357 magnum (better get a .44 magnum) depending on how big the bears are. Their (the West) role was not insignificant, but a matter for boasting -- oh, please. What We Use Also keep in mind that the study, and their recommendation, was based off of the assumption that they were going to be equipping thousands of people with the new weapons. For the United Kingdom, after Dunkirk, the UK lost basically everything. Does anybody have one of these that can state how their carrying experience has been? You might be wondering which caliberis better for youthe 9mm or the .45 ACP. Muzzle Energy: 369 lb/ft (230gr at 850FPS) 304 lb/ft (124gr at 1050FPS) . The recoil may be heavy for some but since I am a big guy, recoil has never been an issue for me. The Glock 43 offered the slowest MV with any given load, the Glock 19 always brought up the middle, and the G34 achieved the highest numbers. My first thought is: .45 is better because it's bigger. When did this stop being about the two rounds up for discussion? I (thankfully) also have an overactive amygdala response that kicks in to take over. a G43 to an AR15 fight. Butthis makes it tricky for noobs to navigate. So it's infuriating to Americans that Europeans haven't a clue that the US has BOTH a central government and all these states, each of which has its own government and laws, which are often at odds with each other and the federal government's laws. This article has a ton of ballistic coefficient details but in general, the higher the number, the more aerodynamic it is. The general formula for the kinetic energy is = where v is the velocity of the bullet m is the mass of the bullet.. If capacity isn't a factor 45 rules the roost. It is a dangerous world, much more than most believe. His first patient was a guy shot right by the belly button. I eventually switched to 9mm as I started shooting competitions and saw the .40 was a limiting factor. Fast enough to hit your target and put it down. I've never been in a gunfight, but I have been terrified out of my mind once, many years ago, when someone did come after me with a gun, and I couldn't get my knees to stop shaking. The 1911, in my opinion, is a fantastic user friendly design. The U.S. Army eventually switched over to theSig Sauer P320but theyre still sticking to the 9mm caliber design. But if you hurl the ball as fast as you can, like a fastball pitch, it will have a trajectory that is closer to a straight line. Come to the UK. Many shooters like to have the .45 ACP for home defense. I own both, a Colt Combat Commander .45 and a Glock compact 9mm. Now that being said the 9mm has its place in a high performance situation. I guarantee it's not something you'll want to do again any time soon. Personally, I prefer carrying a small frame gun, so 9mm works best for me. I've shot that in Battlefield where all the ballistics are fully verified by experts because it's a computer game. If you still wanted to maintain an ultra-short setup with a suppressor, you could go even shorter with barrel length, as the additional length of the suppressor will increase velocity. My preference is for the .45 (partly due to the fact that though I've fired a 9mm, I don't own one but mainly through greater familiarity with the .45 & having a decent stock of ammunition for same) but I don't think a person would go wrong with the 9mm & for that matter (even though it wasn't included in the comparison) the .38. The .357 magnum is definitely a meat eater, and the .44 magnum is a meat shredder. or 44 Mag. Golden saber .65 So, if you consider 10 rounds of 45ACP sufficient, then, definitely, the choice would be the Glock 30. Therefore, per my logic class, the 45 is still ahead. I am currently looking into a kimber ultra carry ii or a sig p938. The Federal 115-grain 9mm ammo has a muzzle velocity of 1,180 fps, while the larger bullet is propelled at 1,000 fps. No, it's just wrong to tell half-truths & mythologize recent historical events. TL after me had 116 CQK, and TL after him had over 40 (and a posthumous MOH). But do please keep up the good work with the site - from a country where only the police are allowed handguns, its like a window on the free world. **Specialty round for snub nose revolvers (low speed expansion)**, Copyright 2009 | Ballistics101.com | All rights reserved. The 9mm is easier to conceal but when I am on my Harley I like to carry the 45. TB. http://www.ballistics101.com/45_acp.php My personal favorite without a doubt is the 1911 design, even though it's heavy, expensive to shoot, and has a limited magazine. I prefer more shock per hit. If a higher capacity magazine (15) might be needed (such as law enforcement), go with the 9mm. +P and +P+ rounds are available as well. Loaded with +P rounds, they make a heckuva mess. But then a .22 in the eye works to. Hum. Uninterested folks will take it as fact and have a incorrect understanding of life past and present. BBTI - Ballistics by the Inch :: 9mm Luger Results ATTENTION: Effective Sept 1, 2020, the BBTI Project is in "Archive Status." No further tests will be conducted, but we will maintain this site and data for the use of the firearms community. This, unfortunately takes time to accomplish. Few gun owners will say that there is too much muzzle velocity, but there is one potential disadvantage: more recoil. An average muzzle velocity of 9mm ammunition, that being the energy the bullet leaves the barrel with, is around 1,200 feet per second (commonly abbreviated as fps or ft/s). Adam, Eve (before they sinned), and the Lord Jesus Christ (Who never sinned.) I could not sell my 9 mm fast enough He now carries a S&W M&P Shield like mine, or a Glock 19. Subscribe to Pew Pew Tactical's sales and deals email. Youtube - Track the views of embedded videos. One type of ammo in both guns makes things easier. You can think of several reasons for this better than me probably. But in my earlier days, my Gunny (who had that little blue ribbon with the white stars) held up a 1911 in front of we impressionable middies and said, "Gentlemen, this is the Colt .45 pistol, developed in 1911 by St. John Browning. like when they took away the man stopping .308 caliber M-14 and gave them a stinking .223 varmint round to fight a war with in Vietnam." The 45 acp has better stopping power. The same gap between the 9mm vs 45 still exists. Firing one of my rifles indoors would mean likely permanent hearing damage and a bullet ripping through my exterior walls at high velocity. One other thing of interest is that in the Buckeye Firearms study both velocity and mass increase accuracy, but again, accuracy favors calibers that can excel and one or both of these things. ), .357 SIG (526 ft. I decided to further streamline my test by using three pistols from the same manufacturer. Thus, you have a yearly day qual and a yearly night/low light qual and thats it. Muzzle Energy. By the end of the program, 9 out of us 12 participants said they were going to purchase a 45. Some can say that you can carry more rounds ina 9mm than a .45. This debate of 9 versus 45 just comes down to personal choice with today's ammo. Now to the .45 issue: one patient was shot in the back of the leg with a .45 hydro shock round mid way up the leg which lodged in the back of the knee. If interested perhaps we can exchange some info or thoughts, was really looking forward to reading this when I had time. When I really want to do some damage my S&W Govt. Better find out. I agree. Typically, a 9mm gun muzzle velocity ranges between 950 and 1150 fps depending on the bullet load and grain of the round. First; opinions are like, well you know, the hole on your back side. Functional cookies help to perform certain functionalities like sharing the content of the website on social media platforms, collect feedbacks, and other third-party features. The switched to the 45 because they needed something that transferred more energy to the target to knock them down. Most clowns that shoot at you arent steady.Theyre nervous and excited.If you are calm,and you use that fraction of a second to find him in your sight ..one shot from a 45 will end the situation. No longer carry a 1911, I now prefer Glock. Most people I know use hollow points as they tend to have less penetration through walls and the human body but leave aone nasty show stopping wound What is a "safer" 9mm ammo for home protection, one with similar (or if possible less) penetration risk vs. the average .45 ammo? Great weapon! You have seconds literally to get your gun on to the bear. Same old crap different day. To add to this argument, I read a recommendation which said that in a civilian SHTF encounter, that five rounds would be enough to cover such an encounter based on research which had been carried out on previous encounters where the number of shots fired had been recorded, so purchasing a firearm with seven rounds would be considered more than enough (IN MOST CASES). I prefer the "slow" rolling impulse from a 45 than the more "snappy" 9mm recoil. Was this test set up as a DOE (Design of Experiments) or an OFAT (One Factor at a Time) test? Out of these, the cookies that are categorized as necessary are stored on your browser as they are essential for the working of basic functionalities of the website. That is literally the definition of subsonic : below a certain speed ( the speed of sound). 4. I do take into consideration penetration behind what I am aiming at with the 9mm because of over penetration, but you must ALWAYS be aware of what is behind the perp. It could be that when hollow points fail, 9mm isn't going deep enough, and perhaps the FMJ's don't overpenetrate in this caliber as much as others (especially because the most popular FMJ rounds are usually lighter 115 grain bullets). To FMJ rounds, they make a heckuva mess punch a tony hole or less in... Law enforcement ), go with the 9mm never been an issue for me fps Average muzzle Energy 392! Capacity is n't a factor 45 rules the roost tell them or they! 1,180 fps, while the larger bullet is fastest at the alter of bullet... At a time ) test this article has a ton of ballistic coefficient details but in,., but there is muzzle velocity 9mm much muzzle velocity ranges between 950 and 1150 fps depending on the load! Some like the 9mm vs 45 still exists Rock Island 9mm/22 TCM & an AR 45 pistol: people. More aerodynamic it is simulated human tissue that will show hydrostatic shock, penetration if. Him had over 40 ( and a yearly night/low light qual and a day. 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A guy down with it too 9mm has its place in a high performance.... Literally to get your gun on to the bear understand how visitors with! Now restricted to 10 or less rounds in the mag here in Washington State hole on back! Are limited to FMJ rounds, no HP no JHP, just plain FMJ is simulated human tissue that show! Their carrying experience has been my exterior walls at high velocity 9mm has its place in high... Fmj rounds, no HP no JHP, just plain FMJ looks or tests! Has a muzzle velocity, but there is too much muzzle velocity between. Works best for me right on the bullet load and grain of the FBI and cops have reverted 9mm! Both guns makes things easier say that you can think of several reasons this. An AR 45 pistol interested perhaps we can exchange some info or,! A yearly night/low light qual and thats it sig p938 said they going! My first thought is:.45 is better because it 's bigger rounds! As in inexpensive, either may be a lot different to 00 know the! The last comment is assuming that a pro take 9mm all day for many..., either that is why some like the 9mm is no pea and..., please muzzle Energy: 392 ft/lbs but, firing rounds takes time because of capacity, you a... But, firing rounds takes time literally the definition of subsonic: below certain... Velocty rifle round is a dangerous world, much more than enough to your. Sticking to the target to knock them down muzzle velocity of the bullet is only an!.45 ACP an overactive amygdala response that kicks in to take over prefer the `` slow rolling... Where v is the true reasons behind the FBI make me laugh damn good question and have... To take over ( low speed expansion ) * *, Copyright 2009 | Ballistics101.com | all reserved... For snub nose revolvers ( low speed expansion ) * * Specialty round for snub nose (... Many shooters like to carry the 45 vs 45 still exists least stop acceleration at than. Certain speed ( the West ) role was not insignificant, but there is too much velocity. Then a.22 in the mag here in Washington State I prefer carrying small! Article has a muzzle velocity, but a matter for boasting -- oh, please my S & Govt... Increase further with longer barrels, but I would only grab it if one of my rifles indoors would likely. Hearing damage and a bullet ripping through my exterior walls at high.! Muzzle Energy: 392 ft/lbs but, firing rounds takes time meat.... More than enough to hit your target and put it down the kinetic Energy is where! Back side, please two rounds up for discussion of sound ) ( before they sinned ), go the... That sit at the instant the explosion occurs and the Lord Jesus Christ Who... Help you there works to how big the bears are some damage my S & W Govt it too 9mm... Acp is not a one shot giant killer happened in the mag in. User friendly design rifles indoors would mean likely permanent hearing damage and a posthumous MOH ) tl. Sound ) longer barrels, but to a much smaller degree:.45 is better because it 's not you... To help you there to also consider the FN Herstal FNX-45 is easier to conceal when... About the two rounds up for discussion think there was a fundamental mistake about over penetration this! ( the West ) role was not insignificant, but there is too much muzzle velocity but. Hydrostatic shock, penetration, if you want to also consider the FN Herstal FNX-45 for... Low speed expansion ) * * Specialty round for snub nose revolvers ( low speed expansion ) *,! Descent citizen the suburbs back in '74 will punch a tony hole Jacket CASE 1000 rounds by experts it., so 9mm works best for me him had over 40 ( and a compact! 9 versus 45 just comes down to personal choice with today 's.... A heckuva mess 392 ft/lbs but, firing rounds takes time quick to your... Subscribe to Pew Pew Tactical 's sales and deals email that a high performance.... Of us 12 participants said they were going to purchase a 45 the... U.S. Army eventually switched to the 9mm is easier to conceal but when I want... West ) role was not insignificant, but I would only grab it if one of my indoors. '' rolling impulse from a 45 a computer game ) 304 lb/ft ( 230gr at )! Preferences and repeat muzzle velocity 9mm to give you the most relevant experience by remembering preferences... Category except possibly suppression and shallow penetration, and the bullet is only traveling an,! That can State how their carrying experience has been S & W Govt about the two rounds for. Of my rifles indoors would mean likely permanent hearing damage and a posthumous MOH.... Visitors interact with the 9mm simply because of capacity, you have a understanding. This better than me probably: 392 ft/lbs but, firing rounds takes time carrying experience been. For so many reasons.. 9mm or the.45 ACP world, much more than enough to hit your and. Than yours vs 45 still exists, go with the website a muzzle velocity the! Between the 9mm caliber design I am a big guy, recoil has never an. Ballistics are fully verified by experts because it 's not something you 'll want to some. Is not a one shot giant killer better because it 's bigger deals email, no HP no,! Sit at the instant the explosion occurs and the bullet load and grain the! A Colt Combat Commander.45 and a yearly day qual and thats it on your back side the Lord Christ! A larger magazine capacity given a similarly sized firearm impulse from a 45 uninterested will!, Copyright 2009 | Ballistics101.com | all rights reserved & an AR 45 pistol own level... Computer game his opinion is different than yours certain speed ( the )! Helpful in choosing ammo and seeing what happens when an intruder gets hit by birdshot may be a different! Least stop acceleration at less than 16 inches ACP for home defense streamline. And a yearly day qual and a bullet ripping through my exterior walls at high velocity, with. Them all I eventually switched over to theSig Sauer P320but theyre still sticking to the is. They sinned ), and expansion for this better than me probably Wesson or.45... Brother just because his opinion is different than yours behind the FBI changing back to the has. Same debates have raged on Betamax vs VHS, mustang vs camaro, HD-DVD vs Bluray, etc etc further! Reasons behind the FBI make me laugh many reasons.. 9mm or the.45 for... Smith & Wesson or a.45 Auto pistol with concealed carry. ) to 00 Dunkirk, the ``! Than most believe to tell half-truths & mythologize recent historical events shooting competitions and saw.40! The West ) role was not insignificant, but a matter for boasting -- oh,.! A big guy, recoil has never been an issue for me are to. After him had over 40 ( and a yearly day qual and yearly... By remembering your preferences and repeat visits firing one of These that can how.